Re: Drain Brameged Inc. Bites the Hand That Feeds It

["Jayiin Mistaya" <masterofwords@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Carol, 

Let's take this point by point, as you did  at least, in so far as 
you organized your rebuttal. 

A) Mockery of an obvious metaphor by treating it as a factual or 
practical request is pundit non-sequitur. In other words: tacky and 
illogical. Basically, bad form in a rebuttal. It sets the wrong tone 
for any kind of logical consideration. 

Now, I don't argue Mad Hamlet's tone was any better; but I do argue 
that if you want to be taken seriously and have your response 
considered in an intellectual or rational way, then approach your 
response in an intellectual and rational way. 

B) Why mention it if you're not going to do it? Like the empty 
threats from schoolyard bullies in years past: "I'd kick your ass if 
I didn't have more important things to do." 

To me, that kind of cop-out has always bespoken cowardice. A fear 
that while you can bluster and boast, there is nothing of substance 
to back it up. What was it Shakespeare said in Macbeth? 

"..[A]a poor player that struts and frets his hour upon the stage 
and then it is heard no more: it is a tale told by an idiot, full of 
sound and fury, signifying nothing." 

Show me, don't tell me that you can hit his rant point-by-point. All 
you're doing now is screaming into the wind. 

Also, just a minor logical fallacy in your argumentation: how can 
you address a presented argument point by point if you do not 
understand half of it? 

As for audience: yes, writing for your audience is a vastly, 
profoundly important concept in writing. I've written quite a rant 
on it myself, found at 
http://www.freewebs.com/iterationobscura/ow_writing_for_me_not_you.ht
m, if you're interested in what I have to say. 

Though I would say he handles audience well. He got you talking and 
posting didn't he> 

C) To quit writing because of one man's comments indicates to me 
that you shouldn't be a writer. In writing, you put yourself out 
there for critique. You put your words out for others to read, 
thereby accepting the possibility that people will not like what you 
have written. This means you either talk with them and get their 
help, or you tell them, frankly, to go to hell and enjoy the trip. 

Obviously, you have a lot of respect and put a lot of stock in what 
Mad Hamlet has to say, otherwise his words would not have caused you 
to quit writing. 

Obviously, though, from the fact that you still write fanfiction, 
this was either a temporary state or a mere deviation from original 
fiction and not writing in general. 

I have known Mad Hamlet for several years now, and I have seen him 
critique dozens upon dozens of times. I have not once seen him give 
a purely negative review, comment or critique. Nor have I seen him 
give a purely positive one. He speaks his mind, clearly and with 
great feeling and passion. 

If that scared you away from pen and paper (or keyboard and screen) 
then I'm not sure why you're responding to this rant. 

D) Excellent! Keep sending little notes to the writers -- that you 
do so, means that a large portion of Mad's rant doesn't apply to 
you. I myself have not posted on this list in some years, and feel 
no guilt over not being more involved. However, I do not read or 
enjoy the same kind of fanfiction writing you do, I think.   The 
Bear is hardly my favorite writer  and I have read many of his 
fics, merely because Mad thinks they're crap.  Since I love to argue 
with the man, I of course read what he hates.

If the shoe fits, wear it. If the shoe doesn't fit, throw it out. 
The same with this rant -- if what he says doesn't affect you, 
ignore it. If it does, address it. 

I have been a professional editor for more than four years now, in 
varying capacities, genres and industries. I have never seen a 
writer truly improve until they've been told what's wrong and how to 
fix it. I've compared it to raking an author across a cheese grater 
suspended over hot coals using a rubber band. They have to want to 
change the piece if they will. 

And on the subject of editing&

'Tis pretty obvious whys you aren't liking no spellin' or no grammar 
talk. You don't got much learnin' there.   Or, at least, it doesn't 
seem that way.

Carol, as well thought out as some of this rebuttal is, it's ruined 
when you use the wrong forms of 'there', `your', and `accepted'; you 
forget punctuation, noun-verb agreement and have rampant tense 
shifts. Basic rules for writing ANYTHING  use proper grammar, 
spelling and punctuation unless you are specifically ignoring them 
to make a point. 

E) The Sky is Falling! The Sky is Falling! Here's a metaphor taken 
too seriously for you. 

There is no true sky. The cosmos never ends. The sky is a veil of 
air and radiation separating us from the cosmos. It's pretty. 

Mad doesn't claim to be or imply he is the center of the universe. 
He does, however, say he will aggressively pursue building these 
communities to greater and greater heights. 

Be nice to the 'would-be' writers. Why coddle or protect them? Not 
everyone will like their story -- and sometimes those people are 
mean. Flamers, true flamers, love that kind of threat. 

Safe and accepted. How can a person feel safe when no one listens to 
each other and you use blatant ad hominem attacks to try to 
persuade, when all it does in enrage. How can they feel safe 
submitting a story that might never get feedback? Or accepted when 
they can't break into the circle of posters who own the list and who 
make the rules, spoken and unspoken. 


> New writers don't need to be whipped and beaten with there work. 
The 
> standard rule for helping someone with a story is to find two 
things you 
> like about the story for every one thing you don't like or think 
needs to be 
> fixed. 

I disagree. New writers need to be discouraged from learning and 
keeping bad habits in writing. New writers need to be guided, 
tested, taught and eventually they will turn into the people who 
help other new writers. 

But you can't always be nice; sometimes you have to be honest with a 
new writer. You can't always be supportive or encouraging, though 
you can be honest. 

F)So? Nice comparison, but why does it have to go the same way? 

If you felt that strongly about the rant -- then I think maybe he 
struck a nerve. Which meant something he said must have had enough 
merit to piss you off to respond. 

Congratulations. You just proved him right as well as proving he can 
write for an audience. 

~alan m rogers 
masterofwords@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
www.iteration-obscura.com 
AIM: Riycte









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