Re: Drain Brameged Inc. Bites the Hand That Feeds It

["Jayiin Mistaya" <masterofwords@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Carol,

Let's take this point by point, as you did.  

A) Mockery of an obvious metaphor by treating it as a factual or
practical request is pundit non-sequitur.  In other words, tacky and
illogical.  Basically, bad form in a rebuttal.  It sets the wrong tone
for any kind of logical consideration.

Now, I don't argue Mad Hamlet's tone was any better; but I do argue
that if you want to be taken seriously and have your response
considered in an intellectual or rational way, then approach your
response in an intellectual and rational way.

B) Why mention it if you're not going to do it?  Like the empty
threats from schoolyard bullies in years past: "I'd kick your ass if I
didn't have more important things to do."  

To me, that kind of cop-out has always bespoken cowardice.  A fear
that while you can bluster and boast, there is nothing of substance to
back it up.  What was it Shakespheare said in Macbeth?

"..[A]a poor player that struts and frets his hour upon the stage
and then it is heard no more: it is a tale told by an idiot, full of
sound and fury, signifying nothing."

Show me, don't tell me that you can hit his rant point-by-point.  All
you're doing now is screaming into the wind.  

Also, just a minor logical fallacy in your argumentation: how can you
adress a presented argument point by point if you do not understand 
half of it?

As for audience: yes, writing for your audience is a vastly,
profoundly important concept in writing.  I've written quite a rant on
it myself, found at
http://www.freewebs.com/iterationobscura/ow_writing_for_me_not_you.htm,
if you're interested in what I have to say.

Though I would say he handles audience well.  He got you talking and
posting didn't he>

C)  To quit writing because of one man's comments indicates to me that
you shouldn't be a writer.  In writing, you put yourself out there for
critique.  You put your words out for others to read, thereby
accepting the possibility that people will not like what you have
written.  This means you either talk with them and get their help, or
you tell them, frankly, to go to hell and enjoy the trip.  

Obviously, you have a lot of respect and put a lot of stock in what
Mad Hamlet has to say, otherwise his words would not have caused you
to quit writing.

Obviously, though, from the fact that you still write fanfiction, this
was either a temporary state or a mere deviation from original fiction
and not writing in general.

I have known Mad Hamlet for several years now, and I have seen him
critique dozens upon dozens of times.  I have not once seen him give a
purely negative review, comment or critique.  Nor have I seen him give
a purely positive one.  He speaks his mind, clearly and with great
feeling and passion.  

If that scared you away from pen and paper (or keyboard and screen)
then I'm not sure why're you're responding to this rant.

D) Excellent!  Keep sending little notes to the writers -- that you do
so, means that a large portion of Mad's rant doesn't apply to you.  I
myself have not posted on this list in some years, and feel no guilt
over not being more involved.  Howeer, I do read and I don't enjoy the
same kind of fanfiction writing you do, I think.  

If the shoe fits, wear it.  If the shoe doesn't fit, throw it out. 
The same with this rant -- if what he says doesn't affect you, ignore
it.  If it does, address it.

I have been a professional editor for more than four years now, in
varying capacities, genres and industries.  I have never seen a writer
truly improve until they've been told what's wrong and how to fix it.
I've compared it to raking an author across a cheese grater suspended
over hot coals using a rubber band.  They have to want to change the
peice if they will.

'Tis pretty obvious whys you aren't liking no spellin' or no grammar
talk.  You don't got much learnin' there.

Carol, as well thought out as some of this rebuttal is, it's ruined
when you use the wrong form of 'there', you forget punctuation,
noun-verb agreement and tense shifts.  Basic rules for writing ANYTHING.

E) The Sky is Falling!  The Sky is Falling!  Here's a metaphor taken
too seriously for you.

There is no true sky.  The cosmos never ends.  The sky is a viel of
air and radiation separating us from the cosmos.  It's pretty.

Mad doesn't claim to be or imply he is the center of the universe.  He
does, however, say he will aggressiverly pursue building these
communities to greater and greater heights.

Be nice to the 'would-be' writers.  Why coddle or protect them?  Not
everyone will like their story -- and sometimes those people are mean.
Flamers, true flamers, love that kind of threat.

Safe and accepted.  How can a person feel safe when no one listens to
each other and you use blatant ad hominem attacks to try to persuade,
when all it does in enrage.  How can they feel safe submitting a story
that might never get feedback?  Or acccepted when they can't break
into the circle of posteres who own the list and who make the rules,
spoken and unspoken.


> New writers don't need to be whipped and beaten with there work. The
> standard rule for helping someone with a story is to find two things you
> like about the story for every one thing you don't like or think
needs to be
> fixed. 

I disagree.  New writers need to be discouraged from learning and
keeping bad habits in writing.  New writers need to be guided, tested,
taught and eventually they will turn into the people who help other
new writers.

But you can't alwasy be nice; sometimes you have to be honest with a
new writer.  You can't always be supportive or encouraging, though you
can be honest.

F)So?  Nice comparison, but why does it have to go the same way?

If you felt that strongly about the rant -- then I think maybe he
struck a nerve.  Which meant something he said must have had enough
merit to piss you off to respond.  

Congratulations.  You just proved him right as well as proving he can
write for an audience.

~alan m rogers
masterofwords@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.iteration-obscura.com
AIM: Riycte








------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> 
What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?
Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/pkgkPB/SOnJAA/Zx0JAA/RoMolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~-> 

Willow: "It's a good fight, Buffy, and I want in."
Buffy:  "I kinda love you."
                     'Choices'

Community email addresses:
     Post message: buffywantswillow@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
     Subscribe:    buffywantswillow-subscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
     Unsubscribe:  buffywantswillow-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
     List owner:   buffywantswillow-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Shortcut URL to this page:
     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/buffywantswillow

Official archive for the list:
     http://www.ikoly.com/fanfic

Other links to Buffy/Willow fics:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/buffywantswillow/links  
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/buffywantswillow/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
   buffywantswillow-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
   http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/